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How did Pixy fire on Cipher?


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18 replies to this topic

#1
SlyCooperFan1

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Excuse my lack of knowledge in the aviation department (ironic, right?), but something's been bothering me ever since I played that mission for the first time. How exactly was Pixy able to fire on Cipher? As I understand it, IFF does not allow a plane to lock onto someone that the IFF considers an ally; new data has to be transmitted from an AWACS or something similar to change the IFF's classification of certain units. Can someone clear this up for me?

#2
Penzor

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If AWNB had engineers to work on the V2 ICBMS, then we can guess they had engineers to reroute/hack IFF systems.



#3
XDragon

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Wouldn't the 7 nukes also set off EMP blasts that would have fried the electronics on the planes?

 

But I could be wrong there.

Anyway, to your question...maybe Wizard 1 transmitted the new IFF? A World With No Boundaries seems pretty resourceful for a terrorist organization so it's possible he was able to share data?



#4
CayceG

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All IFF does is tell you whether another plane is squawking a certain code.

 

IFF doesn't interfere with locking on to targets, AFAIK. And even then, it has no bearing on infra-red locks.



#5
SlyCooperFan1

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Wouldn't the 7 nukes also set off EMP blasts that would have fried the electronics on the planes?

If so, then Cipher should have been able to fire on Crow Team as well as Pixy. 
 

All IFF does is tell you whether another plane is squawking a certain code.
 
IFF doesn't interfere with locking on to targets, AFAIK. And even then, it has no bearing on infra-red locks.

So in real life, friendly fire is completely possible because you can lock onto a friendly?

#6
XDragon

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Well the frying of the electronics has more to do with how the planes stayed in the air.

Huh, didn't know that. I thought IFF made it impossible to lock on



#7
CayceG

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 So in real life, friendly fire is completely possible because you can lock onto a friendly?

 

Yes.

 

In fact, there have been instances where it's happened. Mostly with infra red missiles. The most recent example I know off the top of my head was a Russian Su-25 pair that were on a training flight. The 2nd plane accidentally fired an R-60 (like a Sidewinder, basically) at the lead plane and destroyed it.

 

Likewise, back during Desert Storm a HARM launched from one of the Coalition fighters caught a B-52's radar emissions and tracked to and exploded near the B-52, damaging it.



#8
XDragon

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So, logically we should have been able to return fire at Pixy



#9
CayceG

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Yes.

 

Except it's a game, so... plot armor.



#10
XDragon

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Would 7 nuclear explosions have done anything to the flight systems in the planes to bring them down instead of allowing them to keep flying? Basically an EMP I'm assuming Galm and Crow Teams were basically near Ground Zero 



#11
CayceG

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They probably wouldn't have fell out of the sky. But I'm sure some systems would have been affected. Keep in mind that F-16s and F-15s and the like were cleared to drop nuclear bombs. So they'd be close to any explosions in real life had they been tasked with that mission.

 

 

Otherwise, plot armor.



#12
Hue

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Pixy just has telescopic vision. That is all.



#13
Yellow 13

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They probably wouldn't have fell out of the sky. But I'm sure some systems would have been affected. Keep in mind that F-16s and F-15s and the like were cleared to drop nuclear bombs. So they'd be close to any explosions in real life had they been tasked with that mission.

 

 

Otherwise, plot armor.

 

Considering the first nukes were dropped by slow, propeller-driven bombers, with no reported problems (IIRC), I don't think it's an issue.



#14
Broth3r

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Considering the first nukes were dropped by slow, propeller-driven bombers, with no reported problems (IIRC), I don't think it's an issue.

 

They also had a lot less electronics and none of them in the flight controls.



#15
Yellow 13

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True enough.....also, no concept of EMP?   Or was that discovered in the original tests?

 

I'm sure I read somewhere that (at least) some mil aircraft parts are EMP-protected.  Between then and now, I'm sure, some upgrading has taken place...... 



#16
Inverter

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Yes.
 
In fact, there have been instances where it's happened. Mostly with infra red missiles. The most recent example I know off the top of my head was a Russian Su-25 pair that were on a training flight. The 2nd plane accidentally fired an R-60 (like a Sidewinder, basically) at the lead plane and destroyed it.
 
Likewise, back during Desert Storm a HARM launched from one of the Coalition fighters caught a B-52's radar emissions and tracked to and exploded near the B-52, damaging it.

I don't recall exact locations, but I know of several Vietnam engagements that involved over 150 aircraft at a time. Obviously, IFF and transponder squawk is really important in that kind of situation.

#17
Oka_Nieba

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One word: Sidewinders.

#18
Yellow 13

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I see your Sidewinders and raise you Flares.



#19
XDragon

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I'll meet your Flares and raise you an ECM Jammer.

 

Considering the first nukes were dropped by slow, propeller-driven bombers, with no reported problems (IIRC), I don't think it's an issue.

 

Yea, the B-29 who dropped "Little Boy"  I believe was simply told to release his ordinance and bank hard, and not to look. 

As to the EMP, it was known but the extent was not realized until the late 1950's.